Transcript
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From the time that they pronounced me deaf was a good 45 minutes.
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They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped.
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And I could see people screaming and crying, but I didn't realize that was actually my
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physical body because I was somewhere else.
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The only thing that I could feel, if you could imagine, absolute love and peace, there wasn't
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anything else to be felt.
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I was greeted by people I'd known in the past.
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I'm back home again.
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Incredibly safe and felt at home.
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Welcome to Round Trip Death, everybody, and welcome to our very special guest from South
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Florida, Dr. Joy Pugh.
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How are you today, Joy?
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I'm doing good in the South Georgia, but I am very close to Florida.
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But I'm in the very end of Georgia, down by the Okefenoke Swamp, where the most people
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have heard about and cartoons and things of that nature.
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We're going through a little cold snap.
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And of course, it's really pretty in South Georgia.
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I just appreciate you asking me to be on your show today and look forward to our discussion.
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You're welcome.
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And whether it's Georgia or Florida, we'll just call you a Southern Belle.
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How's that?
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Thank you so much.
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I do have a little bit of a Southern drawl.
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That's okay.
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We like it.
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Before we jump into your NDE and other experiences that you've had in your life, which are, there's
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a lot of them, tell us just a little bit about you.
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And I'm going to throw in first, you're a very prolific writer.
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You've written a bunch of books.
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Tell us a little bit about that in your life in general.
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Well, I've written 15 books, and most of them are about the end of days and about end
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of times.
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So they are all nonfiction books that I write.
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And then I have a couple of unique books that talk about my life.
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One parables of joy on a Georgia farm that talks about a dream that I had when I was
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six years of age and really saw what I believed was the end of time and actually absolutely
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saw what I believed was Jesus.
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And so since I was a little girl, writing and putting things down on paper have been
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very important to me.
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And I was fortunate when I was born that the first week that I was here on this earth,
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my grandparents took me to church.
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And of course, I came to know the Lord and was saved at the age of 11 in a southern Baptist
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church here in South Georgia, not far from where I live.
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And so all of my work revolves around the understanding of where we are in this particular
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age in which we are living.
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I mean, that was one of the things that I grew up wanting to know more than anything after
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having this dream at age six, that I would live to see what I am now seeing in the headlines
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across the world.
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So everything that I have done in all the work that I do, again, is nonfiction and to
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have had my work in a large variety, I guess, of platforms.
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And I feel very, I guess, humbled because I feel like God really put me on a path to
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do what I do.
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And I really want people to understand that we are not just grains of sand floating in
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the space.
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Every one of us has a rhyme and a reason to be here.
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And I think that's one of the things that over the course of my life and having seen
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and heard about people who had near-death experiences, why I always incorporated that into my research
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and why I always took the time to try to find people or to let people know that I was interested
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in this field of work and would have them come and sit down and we would have a long
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discussion and let me record them and talk to them and that kind of thing.
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And really, my hope was is to take and correlate all that information together for people to
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see that we don't die.
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You know, Scripture has always told us that we do not really die.
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It says, the physical body goes to sleep, but it never tells us that our spirit body
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and our soul ever die.
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So anything that kind of correlates to my work and confirms it gives it more credibility.
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And in a world in which we are living now where fake news is the big thing, I want people
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when they read my work to know that I have done every possible rabbit hole to make sure
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that I give you the complete truth of what is out there.
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And maybe that goes back because my undergraduate work for two years was in pre-law.
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My father always wanted to be an attorney.
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So when you read my work, I put you in a box and I kind of box you in with all the information.
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I've thought about every possible possibility of every question you might ask in regard
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to that particular thing that I'm discussing with you because I want you to know the truth
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because I believe the truth will set you free.
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Oh, I'll bet you haven't thought of all my questions.
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I'm hoping that this is how I learned.
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My listeners know I come up with some weird stuff and it's how I learn.
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And so I appreciate it.
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You mentioned end of days and end of time.
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What's the difference?
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Well, the end of days is what we see as it being like a 24-hour period.
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And I think that that's the thing that's most interesting to me is how in scripture it talks
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about that there will come a time when we will go through a period when everything will
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change to something different than what it is now.
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And because I've studied what light is and what pure light is, I believe that time actually
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stands still from a scientific standpoint is that it is all-encompassing.
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So it's not like our 24-hour days that we have on this planet because in reality, whether
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you're on this planet or you're on Mars or if you're on Jupiter or Saturn, the days
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are totally different.
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So time in essence is different because it's spinning at a different frequency.
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And frequency is something that I've been very interested in.
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In fact, in my new book, Be Smart, that has just come out, I talk about a lot of what
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frequency and how it affects us because time is really based on us, on the earth, but it's
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not time in general because of infinity.
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And then the end of time, we think about when we talk about Jesus and God and how our
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Alpha and Omega, we can understand that from Alpha to Omega, and if we think about eternity,
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then it's just on and on and on and on and on.
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So the time that we know as a 24-hour period of time, once we either step into a field
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of paradise or into a gate of hell, that time will become something that is eternal.
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It's not like night and day, 24 hours, sun, moon, morning, the next day.
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And people that have had NDEs say that when they were out of their body, away from here,
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that time did not exist.
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That's a very common thing that people say.
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Totally different.
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And I know that we're going to talk about what happened to me about 20 something years
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ago, and that is that I feel like that I absolutely was out of my body.
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I don't know whether I had quit breathing, have no idea whether I had quit breathing.
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I was laying flat down on the bed next to my husband, and all of a sudden, which I was
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usually a stomach sleeper.
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I like to roll over and sleep on my stomach since I was a child, but it was like all of
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a sudden I was standing on the outside of our bed on the side actually facing the lake
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where I live, and the curtains were drawn behind me, and I could see the room clearly.
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It was dimly lit like at night when you would be asleep.
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And I remember standing there and looking at the bed, and I'm seeing myself laying in
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that position flat on my stomach, and him actually sitting and laying facing straight
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up looking at the ceiling, of course he was asleep.
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And I stood there looking at that, and then all of a sudden I look down at me, and I'm
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like, it's still me, and I am still here.
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And then my mind, I knew, you know, my husband meowing the bed, I knew that that was me laying
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there, but at the same time I was like standing out there knowing that this is me too.
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And my mind was there, and I'm so processing all of this, and it's quite like, you just,
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unless you ever have this happen, it's hard to describe how amazing that is.
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It's absolutely amazing to know that you can get outside of your body.
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You know, I'm standing there just observing everything because that's me.
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I ask a million questions, I've always been that way, so I'm like observing everything,
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everything.
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And then all of a sudden it's like I'm pulled back into my body, and when I get back into
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my body, immediately my eyes open up.
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I remember the pillow being right in front of my face and taking my hands because I was
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always athletic, just like a push-up.
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And I took my hands straight up and pushed straight back into bed and come straight up
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off the bed.
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And I'm looking around because I knew that I had been outside of my body.
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I was in exactly the position that I had seen myself in.
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And of course my husband, who had been asleep, when I come straight off of that bed, pushing
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back like that, and I'm just grasping for air.
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So I don't know whether, again, I had stopped breathing.
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I don't know.
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But I will tell you, I was grasping for air and breathing very hard.
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My heart was going 100 miles an hour, and I'm like looking at me and making sure I'm
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okay, but it's like, what just happened to me?
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And of course he's jumping up thinking something terrible is wrong, and he's trying to comfort
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me, and I'm kind of just trying to get air in, and it's scaring him.
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And then finally, when I finally quit doing all of that, and he's understanding that I'm
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not dying or something weird thing, I'm like, you just won't believe what just happened.
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And of course he was trying to console me, it'll be okay, you're okay, because I think
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he was so scared by the way I was trembling and breathing.
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But we finally talked about it a little bit, and at that point in time, I was not really
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understanding what really just happened to me.
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Did I die?
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Was I dead?
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There was all these questions just coming into my mind.
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I remember that night, he laid back down, and I don't know if he ever went back to sleep,
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but I'm going to tell you, Eric, I never went back to sleep.
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I laid there, I'm looking at the ceiling, I look over to my left, and I'd see where I
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had been standing, and I would look at, and it looked identical, the lighting in the room
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at that time of the morning, everything.
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So I had to have seen it.
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It was not like I could have dreamed it.
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I knew that what had happened to me was that I had been on face down on that bed, I saw
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myself, I've been standing over there in front of those blinds, how the room, everything
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looked, how he looked laying there, sleeping, everything, it was just everything.
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And so I did not go back to sleep.
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I don't know whether I didn't go back to sleep because I was scared that I had almost died,
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and maybe I just wanted to feel my heart keep beating.
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Maybe you were afraid it was going to happen again.
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I don't know.
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I don't think I'm scared of dying.
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I just think it was just a revelation.
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Does that make sense?
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Yeah, but tell me more about that.
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This was a very brief experience, and just to remind our listeners, NDEs, near-death
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experiences include some other definitions like outer-body experiences, some spiritually
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transformative experiences, things like that.
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And I think some people, I don't know, maybe they don't give enough credibility or something
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to an experience they've had because it was very brief, like what you're talking about.
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And that's one of the reasons that I wanted you to talk about this today, because it's
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probably more relatable to some people that haven't had their heart stop and they had
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the big experience through the tunnel and the light and met other beings and things
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like that.
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These things can be very short and sweet, and as in your case, you can learn a whole
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lot from it too.
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Yes.
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I think that that was the thing, is because I have always wanted to know what it was like
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in the spiritual realm, and of course reading and scripture about where different prophets
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were able to see in the spiritual realm and how they would talk about the things that
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were there.
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It just gave me, and I always believe this.
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I believe God allowed that to happen to me so that the work that I do and the people
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that I've talked to and that have had near-death experiences that I didn't laugh it off, that
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I took them very seriously, that I ask every question I could ask of that experience, watching
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how they reacted and how it manifested in their lives, how it changed their lives.
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Because it's like this, it's like seeing is believing, and we know that even when Jesus
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died on the cross, he had a disciple that said, unless I see him, I'm not going to believe
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you all that he's alive.
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Unfortunately, we're all that way, whether it be people seeing a UFO or a UAP, they call
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them now.
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Seeing is believing, and so I really believe that because the Lord called me to do the
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work in the ministry that I do, that He has allowed many things, not just this, but many
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things for me to have to walk through because my life has had a lot of hills and valleys
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of things that people would never dream that I've walked through.
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But it's allowed me to have that understanding at a level that you need to have when you're
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dealing with people under certain circumstances.
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And I think that made me, this experience made me understand definitely life after death.
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Definitely my spirit body looks like my physical body.
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Definitely that my mind is not laying in that so-called physical shell.
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It is with me.
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It has not left me.
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I am always going to be me like scripture says, the spirit and the soul never die.
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So the moment you step out of that body, you are you and you know who you are and you know
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where you are and you know the people you're looking at.
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So that helped me when I had people coming in to sit down to do consultations or counseling
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or just wanting help to understand what did they go through and I need to talk to someone
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about it.
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And I think that gave me, if they wanted to take 10 hours, Eric, to talk about it, I took
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10 hours to talk about it.
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And you've done that for counseling and for your research.
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I'm just curious.
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Tell me maybe a couple of questions that you've asked that have come up that have had some
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really sort of, oh, I don't want to call them outlandish answers, but some really special
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fun answers.
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And what are some of your favorite questions?
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And I'll try to keep them in mind so I can do my job better here too.
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Sure.
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I had a, I'll talk about one of the near-death experiences, one of the guys that I knew.
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He was married to a girl that I actually went to high school with.
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She was a little bit younger than I was.
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And he went down to have a liver transplant in Jacksonville and he was waiting to get
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the liver transplant and he died on the operating table, was pronounced dead the whole nine
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yards.
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And so because the girl knew about my work, when her husband started talking about what
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had happened to him, she says, oh, I just want you to tell Dr. Joy, please, please promise
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me.
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So her mother still went to church where I went to church and she told me that her daughter
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and husband were really wanting to speak with me about something.
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And unfortunately, Christians, unfortunately, don't want to talk about stuff like that.
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They're scared.
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I mean, I can tell you stories about people that don't want to stand up and say anything
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about it.
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I'm like, it proves to us that there's life after death.
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But anyway, this man, he asked me if I would speak with him and I said I would.
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And I listened to his story and of course he did exactly like what you normally see
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in the situation where someone goes into kind of the paradise thing and not into the hell
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situation.
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But he was there, his heart quit beating the whole nine yards.
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They were in the middle of trying to do the, put the liver in the and everything went south.
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Okay.
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And he said he immediately was hovering above his body and that he could see everybody.
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He knew what was who put the people were in there and what they were doing.
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The doctors, he'd hear them clearly.
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Everything was happening in real time and that he was hovering above them and he was
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watching all this happen.
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Like me, he said, I knew it was me because I could look at me and see it was me, but
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there was also me and they're on the operating table.
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Dot dead.
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And then he said it was like a quick pull and he felt like he was going on under miles
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an hour through this tunnel.
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And he said he got up in through the tunnel and that he started meeting people that he
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had known throughout his life, like a grandmother, things of that nature.
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And they, you know, he knew them and they knew him.
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And as he got closer and closer up the tunnel that he got into this beautiful, beautiful
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light and most all of the ones that I've ever, you know, talked with about this, they would
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say the light you could almost feel it.
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It felt like love.
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It felt like you could feel, you could feel this love emotion that we typically maybe
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feel in the arms of our grandparents or something that you, that you feel this thing.
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And he said he could feel that emotion in the light.
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And as he got closer in almost to the gates, he believed that the person that he met was
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Jesus and that he told him he had to go back.
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And of course, everyone that's ever had a near-death experience and saw Jesus, I would
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tell you, not one of the cases that I've ever dealt with wanted to come back.
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I don't care if they were young, old, had children, had grandchildren, were wealthy,
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everyone that I've ever taught with told me, Joy, if I could have stayed there, I would
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have never come back.
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And I didn't want to hear you got to go back.
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And he said that he was begging not to come back and that he heard someone call his name.
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And he said, I turned to look to see what was, and he said, you can feel yourself coming
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back down into, you know, this tunnel.
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And he said, when he got to his body that he saw his, he was coming back and he saw
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his body laying there dead.
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Okay.
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And as he's coming in, he said, the weirdest thing happened.
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And I had never heard this before.
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It's quite interesting to me.
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He said, I flipped over and went in through my mouth.
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So that was a feature.
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That's unusual.
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Most unusual feature that I had heard because I had never had anybody when I had interviewed
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them.
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How did you get back in?
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I don't remember that I was laying flat on the bed.
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So I just remember standing and then all of a sudden being faced down in the pillow and
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pushing back.
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So I didn't know how I got back in.
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So that was an interesting feature that he said I rolled over and went right in through
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my mouth.
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And that's very common too for people to not remember how they got back in.
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But I think it's interesting that sometimes it's somebody calling to you that brings you
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back.
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And in his case, it may have been a doctor.
302
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Sometimes it's a loved one at bedside or something like that.
303
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Other times, and I've probably had, I don't know, almost half the people that can tell
304
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me about coming back into their body use a term like slammed into my body.
305
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Like it happened kind of hard and fast and wamo.
306
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And some people say, I didn't know how I could fit back in that body because I felt so big
307
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in that body, it looks so little, all these kinds of things.
308
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I think that's a fascinating topic right there, the whole coming back into your body.
309
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Well, you know, the thing that I had often wondered, you know, I've studied things in
310
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the Egyptian literature and they always talked about releasing the soul from the body and
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they use some kind of thing that they opened their mouths with and locked into the jaw
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some way.
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And so I've never really gone into that aspect of trying to understand, but that it was to
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free the soul.
315
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But the interesting thing is, I think they opened the mouth as if the mouth was where
316
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it was going out and coming in.
317
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But he was the only person that I've ever had tell me that he literally saw how he went
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back in his body.
319
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And it was, you know, through the mouth.
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Everybody else is just like I was, you were there one minute and all of a sudden your
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eyes open and you're like, whoa, I'm back in and whatever.
322
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And in lots of situations, it's very painful because this man talked about, he says, I
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had no pain.
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And he says, you go back into a body that's laying there that's been operated on, they're
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trying to do the liver the whole nine yards.
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And he says, you talk about excruciating pain when you're right back in and everything
327
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is as it is.
328
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And he talks about how they had no pain.
329
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One of the most interesting ones, and I'll tell this briefly, I was actually involved
330
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in a company where I interviewed people.
331
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This man comes in and we get to talking.
332
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And the first thing I noticed without saying anything is his whole face is totally destroyed.
333
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I mean, he looked pathetic and that was keeping him from finding work.
334
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So he was looking for me to help him find work in an area that would not be looking at
335
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him physical parents.
336
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And you kind of wanted to go, can you tell me what happened to you?
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But without being forward, I guess, in some way, and I never wanted to make him feel uncomfortable.
338
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But during the course of the conversation, he was talking about how he wanted to find
339
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something like an accounting or whatever, where he was not going to be face to face
340
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looking at people.
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I said, so can you tell me a little bit about what happened to you as a child?
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Because I thought maybe something, he was born that way.
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He tells me that he's a young man in his late teens and that he was riding a bicycle.
344
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He went to cross the street and didn't look at a car that was coming at another angle.
345
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He looked back and when he looked up, the other car was at him.
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And his bicycle hit the front of the car and his head went through the windshield.
347
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And he said, Dr. Joy, the strangest thing happened and I don't want to sound crazy,
348
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but I just want to tell you about what happened.
349
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He says, because most people won't believe it.
350
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Well, you know, I'm sitting there thinking, what is this man fixing to tell me?
351
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And then he starts on a near-death experience.
352
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Well, I want to tell you, Eric, I spent the other people that were waiting to be interviewed
353
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by me had to wait a long time before I let that man out of my office because he literally
354
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talked about the glass.
355
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He saw all the glass stuck into him and to his eyes and how he looked.
356
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He described it to a horrific situation, but he explained what I was seeing, how physically
357
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:08,880
messed up he was in his face and his brain and everything.
358
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So he told about how his body, his head is stuck through that glass and how all the glass
359
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:22,280
in the windshield was stuck into him and that he realizes all of a sudden he's seeing himself
360
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:29,920
go through and he's hung in the windshield and then all of a sudden he is hovering above
361
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his body and he can see his entire body.
362
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,760
He can see his bicycle completely crunched and he can see his body laying flat across
363
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the hood and his head is through that windshield with all that glass.
364
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:47,360
And then he said he could hear people getting out of the cars and screaming and blood running
365
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everywhere off of that car.
366
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I'm sure it was horrific.
367
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And then he could hear somebody calling 911.
368
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:57,640
He could tell you which direction people were coming, what they looked like, what kind of
369
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cars they were driving.
370
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:00,880
And I was asking all these questions.
371
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,920
Then he told me he could hear the ambulance coming in the distance.
372
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I mean, he was literally there hearing all of this stuff happening in real time.
373
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He said, but Joy, the thing about it was he said, I wasn't hurting.
374
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He says, I didn't feel anything.
375
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I felt perfectly normal.
376
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,880
And he says, I'm looking at that body going, that is me down there.
377
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:24,080
He says, he was totally lifeless.
378
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,800
He says, I know that I was dead.
379
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He said, I know.
380
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He said, I was not moving.
381
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:33,840
My chest was, you know, my back was not going up and down like I was breathing more.
382
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He said, I was dead.
383
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,880
And he said, but I was looking at myself going, I'm not hurting.
384
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,560
So then he said that he kept floating a little bit higher, a little bit higher.
385
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:47,160
And he said, you could just see all the area from where the highways came together.
386
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:48,160
And he said he just kept floating.
387
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And then all of a sudden he was in that tunnel like everybody talks about.
388
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And he was going and he started meeting people that he knew, grandparents, aunts, different
389
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:57,440
people like that.
390
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:01,840
And then he got to the Prilly Gates, the same situation, and talked about the beauty of
391
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:03,920
all that was there.
392
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,480
He didn't ever go into the gates, but he knew that it was heaven.
393
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:09,120
No doubt it was heaven.
394
00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:14,080
And he said the colors, and that was another thing that the man that died on the table
395
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:20,080
with the liver transplant, he actually went on to do a presentation for churches because
396
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:25,040
he was in techno kind of stuff and he could kind of make it look like he saw it.
397
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:29,160
But they all said the colors are nothing like the colors here.
398
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:35,080
They're a billion times more bright and you could almost feel the colors.
399
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:41,800
They said that they were just beyond explanation as far as the colors were concerned and the
400
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:47,320
beauty of the plants and the trees and all the stuff that they were able to see.
401
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:52,840
But like happened with the other guy that had the liver transplant, this man encountered
402
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:54,320
Jesus.
403
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,360
He explained what he kind of looked like.
404
00:26:56,360 --> 00:26:59,240
Again, he told he was going to have to go back.
405
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:01,160
And he said, I beg not to go back.
406
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:02,960
He said, I literally beg.
407
00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:04,360
He says, you have to go back.
408
00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:10,200
And again, he said he heard someone call his name and he turned and he said at the moment
409
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,200
I turned he was like, shh.
410
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:20,160
And he said, here I was now inside of an ambulance going to the hospital and that the guy goes,
411
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,360
oh my gosh, he's back.
412
00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:27,520
You know, and he said, joy, the pain.
413
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,880
The pain was unreal.
414
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:34,560
I can only imagine just knowing how bad his face and skull and all the fractures that he
415
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:37,400
had, how he had to be in so much pain.
416
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:42,200
But he said he'll never forget that guy going, oh my gosh, he's back.
417
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,560
The ambulance people, he was gone.
418
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:47,640
They were having been working and working and working on him, trying to get back to the
419
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:48,640
hospital with him.
420
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:54,400
So it's pretty amazing stuff when you see the physical scars and you really realize what
421
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,040
was going on and you got the opportunity to really know these people.
422
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:05,200
And like I say, every person that I have had the privilege of knowing and doing this counseling
423
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,280
with or listening to their stories and trying to incorporate them in the research that I
424
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:15,640
do, every last one of them that had the near-death experience for paradise did not want to come
425
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:16,640
back.
426
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:17,640
And it's been all ages.
427
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:22,520
I was in Walmart one day and when a lady was checking out an old woman, she said to the
428
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,080
clerk, I'm just glad to be alive.
429
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,520
And so the lady looked at her and she says, oh, it's nice to be alive.
430
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:34,240
She says, yes, it is because she said, I died on a table in the operating room a couple
431
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:35,680
of weeks ago.
432
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:39,200
And the girl that was behind the cash register says, oh, really?
433
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:40,200
Oh, okay.
434
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:44,840
And she started taking my stuff and kind of pushing the lady away.
435
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:47,040
And I was thinking to myself, I'm not believing this.
436
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:49,840
I'm in line behind a lady that I just got to talk to.
437
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:54,360
So the lady took off and I'm trying to get this girl to get me checked out.
438
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:56,520
And I went running out in the parking lot.
439
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,600
As fast as I could to try to find this woman.
440
00:28:58,600 --> 00:28:59,960
And I found her.
441
00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:04,040
Her doctor was a doctor that had known all my life.
442
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:08,320
And so I said, look, do you mind if I talk with you about this?
443
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:14,640
And so we must have stayed in the Walmart a lot for about two or three hours.
444
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,560
And then I said, is it possible for me to call you and continue this conversation because
445
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:20,080
I want to know all of this?
446
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:26,640
But the interesting factor of hers was that the doctor knew her really well.
447
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:32,200
When she died on the table, Dr. Morgan, his sweetest guy in the world, he's passed on
448
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,720
now, but he was a great Christian man.
449
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:36,760
And I knew him very well.
450
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:38,560
He kept going, don't you die on me.
451
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:39,560
Don't you die on me.
452
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:41,480
Don't you leave me.
453
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:44,240
Because the woman was an older lady and had been friends.
454
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:50,760
And he was trying desperately with every recitation method possible.
455
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:53,560
And he kept screaming, don't you die on me.
456
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:58,560
And of course, when she did and everything went flatline, she saw all of that.
457
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:04,680
And she saw how upset he was and the people in the room were before she left out.
458
00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:08,840
And then of course, had that same kind of situation where she went in and believes she
459
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,480
believes she saw that Jesus and the same kind of thing.
460
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:13,480
She heard her name.
461
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,120
She was back in the body.
462
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,840
And of course, they had already covered her up.
463
00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:25,760
When Dr. Morgan found out she was still alive, he came to her room and she literally did
464
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,680
tell him, this is what happened.
465
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:33,440
And she said, and I'm going to tell you that I know that I was outside of my body.
466
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:37,800
And she began telling all the stuff that happened and how it was set up and who the nurses were
467
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:42,640
and what kind of stuff they used, things, medical terms that she would not have known.
468
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:46,440
And she said, but I'm going to tell you that you were screaming at me.
469
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:48,320
Don't you do this to me.
470
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:49,840
Don't you leave me.
471
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:55,360
So things of that nature, Eric, when you see all of this and you hear all this, it's amazing.
472
00:30:55,360 --> 00:31:00,880
It's been an amazing ride for me to have had opportunities to get to know people on a personal
473
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:06,000
level about this and to have it be told to me.
474
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:14,520
Now, the ones that I've done where they actually saw hell remind me of the new movie called
475
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:17,840
After Death that has just come out the Angel Studios.
476
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:19,200
Yeah, I've seen it.
477
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:21,280
It's very well done for people.
478
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,480
If you haven't seen it, it's very well done.
479
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:28,720
It just came out at the end of October here in 2023.
480
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,320
There's also on our website, roundtripdeath.com.
481
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:36,080
There's a link to buy tickets there too, and people can find where it's playing around
482
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:37,080
them.
483
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,920
But go ahead, because the hell part is interesting.
484
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:47,080
The ones that didn't get the chance to see Jesus, really, if you go to see this movie
485
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:52,240
after death, you're going to see this man describe these black things that come to get
486
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:59,100
you and that you start falling into a blackness and that these beings or creatures start
487
00:31:59,100 --> 00:32:01,920
gnawing on you and tearing you and pulling you.
488
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:08,120
And I will tell you that the people that I've interviewed that have had that happen, one
489
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:15,160
of them said that they saw this last light that was a little tiny like a pencil light
490
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,200
and that they started screaming, Jesus saved me.
491
00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:24,600
And that the moment when they did that, that they started going back up toward the light
492
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:29,120
and that they came back into their body away from all that.
493
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,520
But those people, they don't do anything wrong.
494
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:35,520
They don't drink, they don't cuss, they don't smoke.
495
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:37,120
They go to church.
496
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:44,680
They are truthfully, you know, they know, they know they saw what hell was going to be like.
497
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:49,880
And they know that there is an afterlife and their lives completely changed.
498
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:55,440
Like on the on the show, you'll see that those people were very aware that they had been
499
00:32:55,440 --> 00:33:01,880
in hell and that there is an afterlife and you better be choosing to follow into the
500
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:08,400
good side of life and not be choosing to follow into the satanic kind of side of life because
501
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,280
there is two places.
502
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:12,240
And that's one thing that I've noted.
503
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:17,520
There's either in a near death experience, either one in paradise or one in hell.
504
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:19,400
There's nobody floating around in purgatory.
505
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:20,400
Okay.
506
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:21,640
Hey, we're going so fast.
507
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,680
I'm going to take a step back real quick.
508
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:24,680
Sure.
509
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,560
One of the things that you mentioned about the person on the bicycle going through the
510
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:30,440
windshield of the car.
511
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,720
I find this fascinating and I've heard this before.
512
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:37,120
And that is in a traumatic accident like that.
513
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:44,040
It sounds like and in the case that you just mentioned, like that young man's body left
514
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:51,120
or spirit left his body before his head went through the windshield, which actually killed
515
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:52,120
him.
516
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:53,120
Right?
517
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:54,120
Yes.
518
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:55,120
I assume that it did.
519
00:33:55,120 --> 00:34:01,280
He just said that when he hit the windshield, that he saw the glass coming and I'm not seeing
520
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:04,040
that with his own eyes going into the windshield.
521
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:05,040
Okay.
522
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:09,800
It sounded like you were saying he was observing it from just above, which may or may not have
523
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:14,040
been, but I've heard from other people that have been in traumatic accidents, automobile
524
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:20,640
accidents and things that right before the moment of impact or the moment of flying off
525
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:27,520
a cliff, they were already out of their body and not experiencing physically that trauma
526
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:32,320
until later when they came back in their body, which I find very interesting and people can
527
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,640
make whatever they want out of that.
528
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:37,000
I'm going to let that go.
529
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:38,000
Okay.
530
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:42,880
That's what I wanted to talk about because you had mentioned pastors in your faith and
531
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:50,160
you're very strong Christian and I have had a number of people on this show tell me after
532
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:54,720
their near-death experience, they just were dying to talk to somebody about it and they
533
00:34:54,720 --> 00:34:59,920
thought, well, what better person than my pastor, my priest, my minister, whoever?
534
00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:06,000
And I went in and I told this person and did not get the reaction I expected.
535
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:15,520
What a reaction that was like either that's something from Satan or you're crazy.
536
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:19,520
Let's talk about that for the religious leaders that are listening.
537
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,000
What can they learn from this?
538
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:23,440
Well, let me just tell you an experience.
539
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,520
I had a lady that I had known all of my life.
540
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:33,320
She was a doctor of education like myself and a very brilliant woman and she was a musician
541
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:36,760
and I was a musician, we had been together in the church for years and years and years.
542
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:43,560
She was a good bit older than I was and her husband had been a deacon for years and years
543
00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:44,560
and years and years.
544
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:45,560
Wonderful.
545
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:51,640
So, I need school teacher at the whole nine yards and she goes into the hospital and dies
546
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:57,560
on the table and she has a near-death experience in which she is drawn into the tunnel, she
547
00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:02,720
goes and she sees the whole nine yards, Jesus, paradise, the whole everything.
548
00:36:02,720 --> 00:36:09,360
And again, she hears her voice and she turns and she ends up back in her body and she
549
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:14,560
would tell you or she did tell me if I could say, like I say, everyone that I ever interviewed
550
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:16,560
said they would have stayed.
551
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:23,160
But she was at a meeting one day and we were having a dinner and I did not know this had
552
00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:24,160
happened.
553
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:25,840
I knew that she had been very sick and she had been in the hospital and all these kind
554
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:28,400
of things a couple of months before.
555
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:34,600
And so, I'm in line getting food and she eases up to me and she says, Dr. Joy, she says,
556
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:39,040
is it possible that you and I might have a few minutes together?
557
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:40,600
And I said, sure.
558
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:44,280
And she said, well, let's just see if we can maybe go over there and eat at one of those
559
00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:45,920
tables and it was away from everybody.
560
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:49,920
And I thought, okay, well, she's got something and she feels like she needs to, you know,
561
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,520
cancel, have to cancel or talk with or whatever.
562
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:55,560
So I went over there and sat down and she sat down and from me she says, now I'm going
563
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:56,560
to tell you something.
564
00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:00,680
And first of all, what I'm going to tell it to you about, she says, this is between you
565
00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:01,680
and I.
566
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,560
And she says, and I don't want anybody else to know about what we've been talking about.
567
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:06,720
I said, fine.
568
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:09,400
She starts telling me this near-death experience.
569
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,360
And I'm like, oh my gosh, you know, because I've known her all my life.
570
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:15,840
I mean, I know from the way she, her expression, the way she's looking at me, the way she's
571
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:20,320
describing it, I have noticed there's no doubt in my mind that everything she is telling
572
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,680
me is exactly as she saw it.
573
00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:26,640
So I'm getting what I feel the most credible witness that I could get about near-death
574
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:29,560
experience and getting to see what she saw.
575
00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:33,360
And I'm like, oh, this is wonderful because I'm thinking, you need to stand up in the
576
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:36,120
church and you need to talk about this and you need to tell everybody.
577
00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,920
And she goes, no.
578
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:41,200
And I'm like, what?
579
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:46,480
She says, no, because my husband and I, he's just scared that if I do that, everybody's
580
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:48,560
going to think I'm crazy.
581
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,440
And that happens, unfortunately.
582
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:53,920
And I was like, no, they won't.
583
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:55,280
People need to hear this.
584
00:37:55,280 --> 00:38:01,320
But do you know until the day she died, she never stood up and did that.
585
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:09,680
And I'm going to tell you that that testimony would have been beyond words, Eric.
586
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:11,680
But I could not convince her.
587
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,600
You know, I'm the kind of person God gave me.
588
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:18,120
Like I said, I've had a lot of things happen to me, but I'm not afraid to stand up for
589
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,000
what I see and I believe.
590
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:23,600
You know, if you don't want to believe me, fine, but I'm going to tell it the way I saw
591
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:26,560
it, the most truthful way I can tell it.
592
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:30,080
And I feel like if you come at me with repercussions, though you're crazy, you're stupid, you're
593
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:35,040
off your DPN, whatever you want to do, you could go at me 100 miles an hour, but I know
594
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:36,200
what I saw.
595
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:37,360
I know what I felt.
596
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:38,920
I know what I'm aware of.
597
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:45,600
So, you know, I have never been affected by what other people think or do.
598
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:52,080
And thankfully God has always put me in positions that I didn't have to, like maybe working
599
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:55,240
for a company and they go, Dr. Joy, you can't talk about that.
600
00:38:55,240 --> 00:39:00,200
It's kind of like when John Mack tried to come out about the UFO phenomena and they,
601
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,120
you know, wanted to slaughter people who opened the gates to that kind of thing.
602
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:07,040
Professionally, they tried to destroy people like that.
603
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:11,840
And I think in the same cases when your death experiences that that has been utilized in
604
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:18,400
some ways too, oh, you're crazy, that didn't happen, you know, conspiracy, whatever, to
605
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,560
keep the truth from being known.
606
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:29,600
And I've always had the scientific mind and the desire to know what God wants us to know
607
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,360
and be open and honest about it.
608
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:38,480
So when I see science and religion converging to prove what scripture says, Eric, I feel
609
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,360
that's the most important thing in the world.
610
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:46,360
But why are some religious leaders saying, no, that didn't happen, you're crazy?
611
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:47,560
I think that they're scared.
612
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:49,360
I don't think that they have a lot.
613
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:50,840
I hate to say it.
614
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:55,320
There are some preachers who are anointed and you can tell they're anointed.
615
00:39:55,320 --> 00:40:01,200
There are some people that just want to go and be preachers and they learn what a book
616
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:05,520
says and then they just regurgitate the book.
617
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:08,040
But they don't know the book.
618
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:10,160
They don't feel the book.
619
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:12,800
They have not experienced the book.
620
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:14,680
And I think that's the difference.
621
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:17,720
It's kind of like playing basketball.
622
00:40:17,720 --> 00:40:22,800
If you had to read the manual to play basketball, if you've ever read, and I encourage people
623
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:27,720
to do this, if you don't believe me, read how to just dribble a basketball.
624
00:40:27,720 --> 00:40:31,680
And you've never seen a basketball and you don't know what dribbling is.
625
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:35,600
And see if you can figure out how to dribble a basketball, just reading about it, seeing
626
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:42,680
it, seeing the ball and absolutely having somebody show you how to do it makes a difference.
627
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:45,720
Because you feel it, you see it, you experience it.
628
00:40:45,720 --> 00:40:50,680
And I think that's the difference is that there are some people who are so caught up
629
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:56,160
and let's just keep it based on words alone.
630
00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:58,160
And that's not the case.
631
00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:59,720
It's not the case.
632
00:40:59,720 --> 00:41:06,600
And in Scripture, we know that there were times when even Jesus himself was transfigured
633
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:10,160
and his own disciples saw that.
634
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:15,720
And they wanted to build a temple to magnify what had happened there on that mountain when
635
00:41:15,720 --> 00:41:22,160
they saw him be transfigured and he's talking to supposedly dead people.
636
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:25,320
And then he comes back and he's still alive.
637
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:29,200
Again, it's like seeing the Red Sea parting.
638
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,440
Okay, the Israelites saw that with their eyes.
639
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,480
They walked through it on dry ground.
640
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,560
But a lot of people think that they can go where they just walked across and need, you
641
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:40,360
know, need deep water.
642
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:44,360
They don't get the power of the miracle.
643
00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:49,680
And I think that's the problem is that there are a lot of pastors who are not anointed.
644
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:58,640
They do not understand how science and religion can make religion provable more so.
645
00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:02,800
I guess it's because we've been taught to keep science over here and religion over here
646
00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:04,600
and never bring the two together.
647
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:08,840
And all the work that I do and all the books that I write, I bring the two together because
648
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:15,840
I believe, and maybe that's the study of a lawyer as a young person, is that if I can
649
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:23,640
make the case more true to what it is, then I want to use every element that's out there
650
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,840
to show you that this is how it really, truthfully is.
651
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:36,440
And it's sad because I believe truthfully, I believe there are at least 10% or more of
652
00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:43,240
people in congregations who have had out of body experiences and near death experiences.
653
00:42:43,240 --> 00:42:50,080
If they were allowed to stand up and tell their stories without somebody being critical,
654
00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:56,200
putting them down, that that would give more credibility to people wanting to follow Jesus
655
00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:59,480
Christ because they know there is an afterlife.
656
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:02,800
And right now, we just celebrated Halloween.
657
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:08,120
Look at all the death, look at all the stuff that you see this promoted in the squirrel
658
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:11,800
on a day of death, on a day of evil.
659
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:15,080
People don't get, I don't think they get it's real.
660
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:20,880
They really think that the devil is this little guy with these, with the pitchfork and horns
661
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:24,640
walking around and dancing on TV.
662
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:30,000
I don't think they get that we're talking about an eternity.
663
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:34,960
We're dropping the bucket at 100, we live all lived to be 120 years old on this planet.
664
00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:40,280
That is a drop in the bucket as far as what will be eternal and forever and ever and ever
665
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:41,280
and ever.
666
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:44,080
And it's going to be one place or the other.
667
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:49,800
But our society is teaching people to think hell is going to be a fun place.
668
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:54,240
There is nobody that's had these near death experiences that says that was fun.
669
00:43:54,240 --> 00:43:58,040
They weren't having sex, they weren't drinking at a bar, they weren't having an orgy.
670
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:02,800
There was no Satan guy dancing around in a red soup partying with them.
671
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:07,360
They were literally being tor- and eaten and pulled and all the stuff that scripture tells
672
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:09,240
us the worm never dies.
673
00:44:09,240 --> 00:44:14,200
And I've told somebody, I said, even look at the tree that Moses encountered, you know,
674
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:15,760
the burning bush.
675
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,560
The bush was on fire, but it was not consumed.
676
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:24,240
When you are in an eternal body, you could burn and burn and burn and burn and burn and
677
00:44:24,240 --> 00:44:26,680
burn and burn and you'd never be consumed because you're immortal.
678
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:33,600
But people are not putting that in perspective that it's either paradise or hell.
679
00:44:33,600 --> 00:44:35,960
And it's not a fun place in the hell.
680
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,640
And they need to be paying attention about what it said.
681
00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:43,960
I read the book, I'm probably sure you have too, that Bill Weiss wrote 23 Minutes in Hell
682
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:45,960
that was a New York bestseller.
683
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,640
I mean, if you look at that, it was a traumatic experience.
684
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:50,040
It was nothing positive.
685
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:56,720
If you go to see that after death movie, you're going to see that that was a terrible, horrible
686
00:44:56,720 --> 00:45:02,560
thing to know that your body was being attacked in a spiritual dimension and you could feel
687
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:03,560
it.
688
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:07,360
And by the way, most of the experiences in the movie are positive.
689
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,800
Just I didn't want people to think it's all negative like that.
690
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:18,520
The reason that I brought this up about religious clergy a minute ago is not to put them down
691
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:23,760
at all, but to let them know, I think we need to listen more.
692
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:24,760
Amen.
693
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:25,760
Right?
694
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:30,800
I think there is something from these stories, whatever religion you're part of, I think there's
695
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:35,560
something from these experiences that people, number one, it's good for them to be able
696
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:42,120
to share and it's good for other people to be able to listen and learn from these things.
697
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:47,200
And if we do that in the right way, it can be a very faith promoting type of experience.
698
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:49,280
So that's why I brought that up.
699
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:50,280
I agree.
700
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:55,560
And I think, I think really angel production should be applauded for bringing this Christian
701
00:45:55,560 --> 00:46:01,440
movie to the forefront about this concern because I'm like you, the clergy needs to support
702
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:02,440
that.
703
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:03,440
Okay.
704
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:06,920
Let's go back to when you were six years old before we finish up here.
705
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,520
We're going in kind of reverse order all over the place.
706
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:10,520
That's okay.
707
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:11,520
That's okay.
708
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:12,920
And you talked about a dream that you had.
709
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:15,440
Hey, I had dreams when I was six years old.
710
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:17,160
I can't remember any of them.
711
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:20,200
I can't remember a dream from last week.
712
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:22,280
This must have been very special.
713
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:25,360
Tell me why you can remember it and what you dreamed about.
714
00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:30,240
Well, you know, it's one of those things that I, in my lifetime, I've had dreams and then
715
00:46:30,240 --> 00:46:31,240
they stay with me.
716
00:46:31,240 --> 00:46:36,320
So I have always felt like that it was more than a dream because most dreams, like you
717
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:40,920
say, you might remember first thing in the morning, then they're gone.
718
00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:45,960
But this particular dream, I was just a little South Georgia girl living on a farm.
719
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,080
I was in the bedroom with my sister.
720
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:49,360
I was six years old.
721
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,080
I laid down to go to sleep like a little kid.
722
00:46:52,080 --> 00:46:53,960
I am asleep.
723
00:46:53,960 --> 00:47:00,200
And then all of a sudden I'm standing in this open field and I can see for miles and miles
724
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:01,200
and miles and miles.
725
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:04,560
And you misunderstand in South Georgia, we have pine trees and you cannot see for miles
726
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:05,920
and miles and miles.
727
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:09,080
So that was the first thing that I noted in the dream that I could see.
728
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:14,160
It was this huge valley, which no doubt in my mind, now that I've studied all of this,
729
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:18,000
that I was looking at the valley, which we know will be where the Battle of Armageddon
730
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:19,720
will be fought.
731
00:47:19,720 --> 00:47:27,160
And the destruction that I saw and the way the sky was magenta and how it looked in
732
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:31,320
the destruction that was there was absolutely overwhelming.
733
00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:39,320
And the thing that was most noted was the loss of almost like sound.
734
00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:45,920
It was like, it was this weird, weird phenomena that I can't really describe.
735
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:47,760
It was bone chilling.
736
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,920
And of course now in the stream, I'm six years old.
737
00:47:50,920 --> 00:47:57,280
I am looking at me and I'm this little girl and then I'm looking around and I'm looking
738
00:47:57,280 --> 00:48:00,480
at all this destruction and how terrible it is.
739
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:05,240
And the thing, Eric, that I first realized is that there's nobody else left.
740
00:48:05,240 --> 00:48:10,800
And I'm standing there and I'm thinking, oh my gosh, there's nobody else left.
741
00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:12,920
And I'm alone.
742
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:16,400
And destruction was just, it was beyond words.
743
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:19,200
And so I was about ready to panic.
744
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:23,280
You can imagine being six years old and thinking, I mean, just imagine you can't find your mother
745
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:24,680
or father when you're six years old.
746
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:25,680
How are you panicking?
747
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:29,240
Imagine what I was feeling like looking at something that I had never seen anything
748
00:48:29,240 --> 00:48:33,560
like in my entire life with fire and brimstone.
749
00:48:33,560 --> 00:48:35,480
And just, it was just unreal.
750
00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:42,160
I'm standing there scared to really dead and looking down at myself and I had my arm in
751
00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:43,160
a sling.
752
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:45,760
It looked like he'd been wrapped.
753
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:51,240
And so I look around because I'm thinking, where can I hide and all this is terrible.
754
00:48:51,240 --> 00:48:59,080
And so I looked kind of to my left and there was like these huge boulders and they were
755
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:00,480
jagged.
756
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:03,680
And I'd never seen anything big boulders like that.
757
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:07,440
I mean, in South Georgia, it's just sand and clay.
758
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:13,600
So I had never seen anything like boulders, like big stones on stack on top of each other.
759
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:18,840
Now that I know and have studied those stones look like the Temple Mount where you got these
760
00:49:18,840 --> 00:49:22,080
huge stones and there, and there were same color as that.
761
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:27,040
And they were stacked like this, except everything was gone except this one wall side.
762
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:29,440
And so I'm thinking to myself, that's the only thing that's left standing.
763
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:31,720
I'm going to go run and get behind it.
764
00:49:31,720 --> 00:49:37,840
And so I go running as fast as I can scared so bad and I run around the side of the wall
765
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:40,960
and there's this man larger than I stand in there.
766
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,360
I never forget he was dressed in this white linen.
767
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:49,680
He had this kind of gold kind of thing wrapped around his waist and he was staring out over
768
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:51,440
that wall.
769
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:55,200
His hair was flowing down on his shoulders and into his back and he had a beard and
770
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:56,280
he was looking at.
771
00:49:56,280 --> 00:50:00,920
And he looked so sad, but almost like the wind was like blowing through his hair, but
772
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:05,640
you couldn't feel the wind, but it was like his hair was doing that.
773
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:10,000
And when I looked up at him and you know, it's kind of like going from being scared
774
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:13,520
to death, to seeing somebody there and you're not by yourself and I'm looking at your six
775
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:18,080
years old and this is most tragic, wonderful thing you've ever seen.
776
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:20,600
It's a wonderful thing to see somebody standing there.
777
00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:26,120
And so he turned and he looked at me and when he did, all I can say is it reminds me of
778
00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:29,120
the way people talked about the emanation of love.
779
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:30,120
You can feel it.
780
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:36,400
It was like I could feel that and his eyes were as blue.
781
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:42,080
I mean, Paul Newman's eyes don't even come clearly and Paul Newman to me had the most
782
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:44,680
perfect blue eyes that I've ever seen in my life.
783
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:45,680
They were all inspiring.
784
00:50:45,680 --> 00:50:49,120
And it's like, oh my gosh, you know, just a little kid.
785
00:50:49,120 --> 00:50:51,240
You're like, you know, and you could feel it.
786
00:50:51,240 --> 00:50:52,240
You could feel his eyes.
787
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:53,600
You could feel his love.
788
00:50:53,600 --> 00:51:01,480
And he looked at me and he was like, you know, I am with you always, even until the end.
789
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:06,320
And then all of a sudden I felt this feeling of like everything's okay.
790
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:14,720
And then I sit straight up in bed and I'm looking around and I'm going, oh my gosh,
791
00:51:14,720 --> 00:51:15,720
you know, it's a little kid.
792
00:51:15,720 --> 00:51:17,440
Well, it scared me to death.
793
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:21,240
So I go running down the hall to where my grandparents, they lived in the house with
794
00:51:21,240 --> 00:51:24,360
us and I would run down the hall to where my grandparents are in the room, they were
795
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:27,000
in the bedroom down the hall from where I was.
796
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:28,440
And I went to my grandmother.
797
00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:33,080
She was my my son, he's school teacher, but she was also the later in life, senior school
798
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:35,320
teacher, but she was just my confidant.
799
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:39,400
And I was like, I called her mommy and I was like, mommy, mommy, mommy, wake up, wake
800
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:40,400
up.
801
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:41,400
You know, it's in the middle of the night.
802
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:42,400
She's like, what, what, what baby?
803
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:43,400
What?
804
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:44,800
And I'm just, I gotta go to the church.
805
00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:45,960
I need to go to church right now.
806
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:49,000
And this is a six year old kid and she's going, you know, what's wrong?
807
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:50,000
What's wrong?
808
00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:51,000
She's trying to console me.
809
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:54,800
I'm trying to go because I'm thinking this is six and to happen.
810
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:58,840
I'm like, I've never seen anything like it, but I knew I wanted to go to the church like
811
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:00,440
right then.
812
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:04,240
So she gets up out of the bed, she comes, she walks me back down the hall, she puts
813
00:52:04,240 --> 00:52:07,680
me back in the bed and she's, she's trying to console me and I'm going, we're going to
814
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:08,680
go to church right now.
815
00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:09,680
We need to go to church right now.
816
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:10,680
And she was like, just calm down.
817
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:11,680
You just had a bad dream.
818
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:12,680
And I'm like, it's not a dream.
819
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:13,680
It's not a dream.
820
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:15,880
And I would, she'd go, just calm down, calm down.
821
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:18,800
And so she says, I'm gonna lay here on the bed with you just to get you to quiet and
822
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:20,120
down.
823
00:52:20,120 --> 00:52:22,000
And so I was continuing.
824
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:23,520
I got to go, going to go to the church.
825
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:27,800
So finally she told me, she says, Joy, when it gets daylight, I will take you over to
826
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:28,800
the church.
827
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,480
Now, why I thought I needed to be at the church, I have no idea.
828
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:35,480
But it was almost like I felt like was the only place that you could have safety, that
829
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:39,040
there was something really bad coming and that I had seen it.
830
00:52:39,040 --> 00:52:43,280
At that age, the next, that's morning when I, when daylight finally came, because I don't
831
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:46,840
think I ever went back to sleep because I could just see all that same stuff.
832
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:53,320
What it did to me at six, you know, because I had been in church like it's safe since
833
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:58,680
first week that was born, my grandmother always sticks to communion for the church.
834
00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:03,680
And she would let my sister and I have the little great Jesus in the little bread at
835
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:04,680
the end.
836
00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:11,280
Well, what happened, Eric, was now when it came time to communion, I wanted to take communion.
837
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:13,600
And she'd go, no, you know, you got to be 12 years old.
838
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:16,880
I believe that you had to be like the age of common ability to make a decision about
839
00:53:16,880 --> 00:53:17,880
Christ.
840
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:21,440
I'm going to tell you from that moment on, when I would take and do that, I would think
841
00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:24,920
about I knew, I knew.
842
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:30,120
So again, you know, I waited until I was 11 years of age and my sister was 10 and we joined
843
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:32,880
the church and gave her a life to Christ.
844
00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:35,880
But I can honestly tell you, I knew that at six.
845
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:40,480
And I have, I told, you know, I told my mother and my grandmother and everything about that
846
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,000
I knew, you know, what was going on.
847
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:47,760
And I've told people, if you have a child at six years of age that tells you they're
848
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:52,120
ready to join the church, they're ready to give their life to Christ, you listen to them
849
00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:53,720
because I knew the truth.
850
00:53:53,720 --> 00:53:56,520
I knew the truth.
851
00:53:56,520 --> 00:54:00,960
And sure enough, I had had preached that so much to my mother and my grandmother and my
852
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:06,520
sister who had heard it, that when she had a daughter, that child, that child at six
853
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:09,680
years of age wanted to join the church.
854
00:54:09,680 --> 00:54:13,720
We were in church, that child wanted to join the church and she got up.
855
00:54:13,720 --> 00:54:18,840
And I thought if somebody says, you're not going to let that child go down there and
856
00:54:18,840 --> 00:54:23,600
give her a life to Christ, I'm going to stand up and give a testimony that she needs to
857
00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:25,200
be accepted at six years.
858
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:30,840
Well, because of what I had gone through, they allowed her to join the church and give
859
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,160
her a life at the age of six.
860
00:54:33,160 --> 00:54:35,080
I knew the truth then.
861
00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:36,680
I understood it.
862
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:41,400
I knew that this was going to happen to me in my life and from that day on, I had been
863
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:43,720
searching, reading the Bible.
864
00:54:43,720 --> 00:54:50,680
And what Jesus told me, I couldn't even read hardly other than run, spot, run, you know,
865
00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:52,160
when you're six years old in the first grade.
866
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:53,760
I mean, that's a long time ago.
867
00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:56,880
That's about where I was at as far as reading.
868
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:02,760
And then a couple of years later, I run across the very thing that Jesus says, you know,
869
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:06,920
you're not alone, I'm going to be with you always, even until the end.
870
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:12,880
And I thought it was weird because the word is, I will be with you always instead of always.
871
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:16,920
And he said, always, just like it was in the scripture, but I had never read that.
872
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:21,600
You know, years later, I'm like, oh my gosh, that's what he told me.
873
00:55:21,600 --> 00:55:23,640
So it was confirmation.
874
00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:29,560
And so then that led me on, you know, when I became 13 years of age, I sat down to read
875
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,160
the book of Revelation because I wanted to know the truth.
876
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:35,560
And how Lindsay's Great Late Planet Earth came out.
877
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,920
And I was in a Rexall drag store with my mother.
878
00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:42,800
And I saw that book and picked it up off the little rack that went rounding around back
879
00:55:42,800 --> 00:55:43,800
in the day.
880
00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:44,880
So little paperbacks.
881
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:47,080
And I looked at it and I went running up to her.
882
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:48,080
I never forget the counter.
883
00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:50,240
I said, mama, please buy this book for me.
884
00:55:50,240 --> 00:55:52,440
She looked at me and she says, what is this?
885
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:54,760
And I'm like, I want to read this book.
886
00:55:54,760 --> 00:55:56,640
And I'd always been an avid reader.
887
00:55:56,640 --> 00:55:58,560
I always loved reading.
888
00:55:58,560 --> 00:55:59,880
She finally gives in.
889
00:55:59,880 --> 00:56:04,880
Eric, I went home and in that afternoon, I read that entire book.
890
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:13,480
And for the first time in my life, I was like, oh my goodness, somebody really understands
891
00:56:13,480 --> 00:56:15,240
what I saw.
892
00:56:15,240 --> 00:56:18,560
But that was almost seven years later.
893
00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:25,440
And if anything, you know, a lot of kids would laugh and cut up and have fun days and stuff.
894
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:32,680
It made me go inward because I would ask a hundred million questions of my Sunday school
895
00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:33,680
teachers.
896
00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:37,560
I had one man that would come out and look at my grandmother and go, Miss Selma, I don't
897
00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:41,800
know where Joy comes up with these questions, but I don't know how to answer them.
898
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:45,120
I have no way of answering her questions.
899
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:49,040
She's asking me things because I would talk about what I, you know, be asking questions
900
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:50,760
about the end of time and what does this mean?
901
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:51,760
What does this mean?
902
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:52,760
What does this mean?
903
00:56:52,760 --> 00:56:53,760
They could not answer.
904
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:55,760
Don't worry about it, don't worry about it.
905
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:56,760
It's just symbols.
906
00:56:56,760 --> 00:56:57,760
It's just symbols.
907
00:56:57,760 --> 00:56:58,760
It's not right for us to know.
908
00:56:58,760 --> 00:56:59,760
We probably will never know.
909
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:03,840
It's not something for you to worry about at this age, but Eric, it was.
910
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:05,920
And I never got away from that.
911
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:10,680
From the time I had that dream, it has been something that's always been a part of my
912
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:11,680
life.
913
00:57:11,680 --> 00:57:15,520
I went on to school and studied to be a lot of different kinds of things.
914
00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:19,320
I went on and got my doctorate, but I'm going to tell you the majority of books that I was
915
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:21,880
reading was still trying to find those answers.
916
00:57:21,880 --> 00:57:24,800
That we are living at the end of days that I'm going to see this happen.
917
00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:31,680
And I want to know everything I can know about our afterlife because it's real.
918
00:57:31,680 --> 00:57:39,680
And the more I can give people true evidence and show them, then they can't be doubting
919
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:41,320
Thomas's anymore.
920
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:47,760
They will come to the truth and make wise decisions because we know, and I know that
921
00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:54,280
my mind and my spirit body was just like this physical body that I'm walking around in.
922
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:56,280
And that it will live forever.
923
00:57:56,280 --> 00:57:57,280
Jesus resurrected.
924
00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:01,080
I mean, a lot of the research that I do is on the Stroud of Turin.
925
00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:06,680
It clearly shows that he resurrected through that cloth and that one day all of us are
926
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:12,440
going to have a resurrected body that we do not literally die when he told the thief on
927
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:17,760
that cross that begged for him to remember him when we came into his kingdom.
928
00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:20,520
Jesus said, this day you will be with me in paradise.
929
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:22,440
He didn't say you're going to be laying out there in the grave.
930
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:26,440
See, that's the thing that most people think is that all those people are laying out there
931
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:28,880
dead in those graves waiting.
932
00:58:28,880 --> 00:58:31,040
No, they are not.
933
00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:36,480
The moment you stop breathing, you are either headed to paradise or headed in the gates
934
00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:43,840
of hell and the parable of the rich man and Lazarus that Jesus taught in scripture tells
935
00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:46,760
you Lazarus was in hell.
936
00:58:46,760 --> 00:58:49,600
He was begging for somebody to cool his tongue.
937
00:58:49,600 --> 00:58:55,400
I have two more quick questions before we wrap up and we're about out of time here.
938
00:58:55,400 --> 00:59:02,280
Recently one of our episodes, we had an interview with a woman and her NDE was spectacular.
939
00:59:02,280 --> 00:59:09,280
It was long and detailed and she met all these various people and I've had a couple of people
940
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:13,480
asked me since, do you believe that one?
941
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:16,800
Now I try to be very non-judgmental on this show.
942
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:21,960
Also if I feel when I'm doing the interview or previous to the interview, like maybe there's
943
00:59:21,960 --> 00:59:26,760
some mental instability or something else going on, then it doesn't become part of the
944
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:27,760
show.
945
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:33,120
So my question for you is, how do you know who to believe and not believe when you hear
946
00:59:33,120 --> 00:59:34,120
these things?
947
00:59:34,120 --> 00:59:41,800
Well, I guess I've done them so much now that usually the first thing is that they don't
948
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:43,400
want anybody else to know.
949
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,400
If I got somebody that wants everybody to know and I want to write an article about it and
950
00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:51,560
I want to become famous and maybe be on CNN talking about it, then I have a little bit
951
00:59:51,560 --> 00:59:52,560
of a question.
952
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:54,400
But that doesn't mean it's a lie.
953
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:55,400
It's not true.
954
00:59:55,400 --> 00:59:56,400
That's right.
955
00:59:56,400 --> 00:59:57,400
That's what it means.
956
00:59:57,400 --> 01:00:03,960
But it just doesn't seem that the people who really are genuinely wanting to know, did
957
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:09,520
this really happen to me and what I saw, what does it mean?
958
01:00:09,520 --> 01:00:12,480
What is your research told you about this?
959
01:00:12,480 --> 01:00:17,280
How does this line up with what other people say?
960
01:00:17,280 --> 01:00:22,520
One thing that I have had a great opportunity and I think that the Holy Spirit has given
961
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:24,360
me is discernment.
962
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:25,680
I feel it.
963
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:33,800
I feel it's because I work with handicapped people and you had to read body language.
964
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:39,640
Body language will tell you so much in a person because sometimes people, they can't speak
965
01:00:39,640 --> 01:00:44,600
good or they can't clearly tell you information and then they may do it in childlike terms.
966
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:49,960
So you've got to be looking at other things than just the person's words.
967
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:58,280
So I think discernment and body language and the ability to tell the story clearly over
968
01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:02,040
and over without changing anything.
969
01:01:02,040 --> 01:01:05,160
It doesn't become something different in time.
970
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:09,400
If you, it's like when I saw the dream, I saw it, but I remember that dream like if
971
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:11,960
I could close my eyes and relive it right now and see it.
972
01:01:11,960 --> 01:01:15,240
And lots of times when I'm talking about it, I can see it happening.
973
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:17,160
I can literally visualize it.
974
01:01:17,160 --> 01:01:25,040
So the people that I greatly have talked to, I have not run into anybody except one person
975
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:32,760
that I felt like had read something and used that to get in to see me, to just see what
976
01:01:32,760 --> 01:01:34,360
I thought about it.
977
01:01:34,360 --> 01:01:38,760
And I just never felt that connection that really happened.
978
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:42,200
And if it did happen, it happened the way they said it did.
979
01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:49,920
But other than that, the people that I talked to, I think were as genuine in describing
980
01:01:49,920 --> 01:01:56,920
it exactly to the T and really not caring about getting any kind of notoriety.
981
01:01:56,920 --> 01:01:59,920
You know, I just say, well, you know, I'll never use your name.
982
01:01:59,920 --> 01:02:05,440
Would it be okay if I discuss this on a radio show if I write about it or whatever, you
983
01:02:05,440 --> 01:02:10,120
know, that middle-aged woman came to me, I ran into you at Walmart, those kinds of things.
984
01:02:10,120 --> 01:02:12,440
Nobody's going to know who your name is.
985
01:02:12,440 --> 01:02:17,040
So it's never like take my name and put it out there, anything like that.
986
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:22,600
But I always felt in the discernment area of my life, and I have to do that a lot with
987
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:27,280
what I do, that I felt like everything was truthful.
988
01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:31,320
And like I say, only on that one time that I feel like that there might have been, can
989
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:34,800
you help me get popular or something of that nature?
990
01:02:34,800 --> 01:02:35,800
Right.
991
01:02:35,800 --> 01:02:41,440
And I hope that we've never had anybody on this podcast that has made some things up,
992
01:02:41,440 --> 01:02:43,920
but there's no way to prove one way or the other.
993
01:02:43,920 --> 01:02:50,720
So I just want to give people sort of a little tool, you know, of how they can know for themselves
994
01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:54,600
when they hear things and discernment makes sense.
995
01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:58,120
And that is a talent that we can develop and become better at.
996
01:02:58,120 --> 01:03:02,400
My last question is this, I love to leave our listeners with some kind of a message
997
01:03:02,400 --> 01:03:03,680
of hope.
998
01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:09,640
So from all of your experiences and all your interviews and all your research and all this,
999
01:03:09,640 --> 01:03:16,120
can you capsize this very briefly into a message everybody is going to put a smile on their
1000
01:03:16,120 --> 01:03:17,360
face today?
1001
01:03:17,360 --> 01:03:18,360
Okay.
1002
01:03:18,360 --> 01:03:22,440
Your soul is your greatest asset.
1003
01:03:22,440 --> 01:03:25,160
It's going to end up in one or two places.
1004
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:27,200
Choose wisely.
1005
01:03:27,200 --> 01:03:31,200
Is there any question that there is an afterlife or not?
1006
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:34,720
In my mind, there is an afterlife.
1007
01:03:34,720 --> 01:03:41,920
And because of what happened to me, I honestly will tell you that it is a great knowing and
1008
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:45,120
it is once you know, you know.
1009
01:03:45,120 --> 01:03:51,520
So live your life not believing that it's lights out or you're some grain of sand floating
1010
01:03:51,520 --> 01:03:56,240
on a beach somewhere that everything is this has no meaning.
1011
01:03:56,240 --> 01:04:00,600
That's the one thing that I found in the research that I did for my book, Be Smart, is that we
1012
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:03,000
all have a DNA that's vibrating.
1013
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:11,840
We all have our own song and our own teen and our creator knows our song.
1014
01:04:11,840 --> 01:04:12,840
That's beautiful.
1015
01:04:12,840 --> 01:04:13,840
Thank you so much, Dr. Joy.
1016
01:04:13,840 --> 01:04:15,320
I appreciate your time today.
1017
01:04:15,320 --> 01:04:18,120
Listen, Eric, thank you for having me on this podcast.
1018
01:04:18,120 --> 01:04:22,320
I've enjoyed it so much.
1019
01:04:22,320 --> 01:04:25,320
Thanks again for listening and sharing this podcast.
1020
01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:29,320
If you've had a round trip death experience, we would love to hear from you.
1021
01:04:29,320 --> 01:04:32,560
Send an email to eric at roundtriptest.com.
1022
01:04:32,560 --> 01:05:01,480
Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.
